[FFML] [FIC][BGC] Frozen Butterfly Arc 3 Chapter 5 Draft

[O David Morgan]

skychan wrote:
>>> It looked something like a cat, ready to pounce even now and I
>>> wondered how much of that was in my mind and how much
>>> was form  following function.
>>
>> Hopefully the Genom tech with the sense of humor didn't give the
>> battlemover a taste for string or belly-rubs, ne? ;)
>> (though maybe he was able to make it do the pre-pounce butt-wiggle thing?
>> haha)
>
> There is something undeniably cute about the thought of a giant
> battlemover giving a wiggle then pouncing to bat a knight saber playfully
> back and forth.

If it looks like a cat, and fights like a cat... must be a DD-J1 
Battlemover! [Genom marketing slogan]
xD

>>> I hmmmed as she elaborated a bit about the corruption she had
>>> uncovered. Instead of listening closely I was far more interested
>>> in examining the battlemover in front of me and admittedly the
>>> warmth of her body pressed against my side. Eventually though I had
>>> to interrupt.
>>>
>>
>> Nice way to evade describing the [story-irrelevant] details here :D
>>
>
> Well it would have just been as boring to the readers as Kari.  Why write
> it out if I don't have to?

Exactly :)
Plus, anything you don't specify won't come back to bite you later.

>> That's one of the things I enjoy about your 33-S conversations: there are
>> a lot of layers to it.
>> I don't want you to change anything here as I don't think Kari grasps the
>> difference, but from a technical standpoint I don't think the sigh was
>> "false"... Sylvie meant to communicate something that she knew Kari would
>> understand, which just doesn't happen to match what outsiders would think
>> she meant.
>>
>> And I like the way you present that, even if I happen to disagree with
>> Kari's conclusion :)
>> (I think I disagree with her a lot, but then I'm contrary by nature--I
>> frequently disagree with a lot of people.)
>
> It is one of the more amusing things to do with the 33-S's.  There should
> be some more of that soon, hopefully it will meet your exacting standards
> again.

I look forward to it ^_^

>>> Reluctantly I only rode with Sylvie as far as the nearest subway
>>> line. It would be unfair to make her my personal chauffer,
>>> especially as I could tell she was anxious to get back
>>> and check on Anri. Although I wasn't looking forward to the commute
>>> I also felt Anri's well being was more important than my comfort.
>>
>> Yay another subway scene! Hahaha
>
> Someone pointed out that was a major thorn of her existence.  So now I
> have to make sure to comment on them whenever they must occur.  Or make
> them occur just so I can comment on them... I wonder which it is, and if it
> was you who pointed it out.

Yup, it was me, ehehe...
On one of my readthroughs this one felt a little more like it was 
"made to occur just to comment on" but you give enough justification 
I'm not gonna worry about it. (I think I mentioned that I've not been 
entirely awake this week.)

>>> The world seemed to swirl around me, vibrant and alive. Around me
>>> marched throngs of young attractive students.
>>> In the haze I focused on Sylvie, it helped. There was no lust
>>> there, no secret unspoken craving, just sisterhood and
>>> understanding.
>>
>> Interesting here. I was starting to think she was getting better at riding
>> the subway... maybe she was just picking better (not-morning-rush-hour)
>> times?
>> ...Or maybe the fresh blood also increases her system's responsiveness to
>> sensory input? That could make things more difficult than expected :/ Seems
>> like she's dealing ok with it though.
>
> Its actually a combination of both.  She has been careful on when she
> rides the subway, and this was the first time she's been caught in standing
> room only for a long while.  As for fresh blood, it does increase
> the efficency of pretty much everything she does.

Wow, both of my guesses were right? Success! :D

>>> Pretending to look affronted she replied quickly. "I'm not
>>> stalking you,I just happened to be heading to breakfast when I
>>> saw you, but enough about me. What were you doing out so late
>>> you're only getting in now?" There was a definite gleam in her
>>> eye making it obvious what her fertile imagination had conjured
>>> but I wasn't going to
>>> rise to the bait.
>>
>> Sounds like a stalker to me -laughs-
>> (Or at least on her way to becoming a stalker? I'm not expecting it but
>> it's starting to feel that way a little bit.)
>
> Well Kari is the first girl she's found attractive, and if I've failed by
> now to show just how impulsive and... experimental and experiential a kind
> of girl Naomi is then I'll have to fix that, somehow.

Oh, no, I didn't mean it that way!
I'm just noting that I do find her stalker-ish right now, but haven't 
made a final judgement on it.
(If I were Kari, I would probably half-jokingly refer to Naomi as a 
stalker for a while, at least in part to try to stop her from being one.)

Sorry if that wasn't clear.

>> Still gotta write out your work for math, but the work itself should be
>> less difficult once she gets Mathmatica installed ;)
>> (What level of math is she taking, anyway? -curious/forgetful-)
>
> She would be taking Calc 2.  Second year with an undeclared major.

Cool. I don't think my college required much math for undeclared 
majors so I wasn't sure... I was a math/comp-sci major though so I 
took pretty much any math course they offered and didn't pay attention.

>>> So it was with great relief that when class ended I found an email from
>>> Nene waiting when class finally ended.
>>
>> Oops, I missed this the first time, but: "when class ended" is repeated
>> there.
>
> Well its got to end when it ends, right?

I should hope it would! :D
An amazing teacher may keep you thinking about the subject matter so 
that you continue to learn things after class... but if the class 
doesn't actually end at the end, I would start looking for the White 
Rabbit or Red Queen ;)

>>> Riding the subway back toward the center of town it felt almost as if I
>>> were a cork bobbing in the sea of humanity around me.  A part yet separate
>>> from my surroundings.  I was nervous.  How would Sylia look at me, as a
>>> person or a machine?
>>
>> and my response to Kari:
>> I still think Sylia is right to see you as a machine. But you do a better
>> job than most of thinking that you're a person, and hopefully you'll be
>> able to get Sylia to treat you that way (regardless of how she sees you).
>
> Hmm, now this is the most hypocritical sounding view I've read in a
> while.   I'm not saying it is, just that it sounds that way.  On the one
> hand pointing out that she IS a machine.  While on the other complimenting
> her on being a person and hoping she can be seen as one.  Talk about
> sending mixed messages if you were there talking with her!  I'm not even
> gonig to say that you are wrong.  There is a lot of machine in Kari, and
> it's actualy growing a bit more pronounced even as the lines between her
> two sides blur and those machine inspired behaviors stop being machine
> inspired.  At least I hope that I'm getting across the fundamental changes
> to her personality.

My stance wasn't entirely clear I suppose:
Kari is definitely feeling more machine-like than she did originally, 
whether she's incorporating those behaviors intentionally or 
unintentionally.
And I am personally more in Sylia's camp (boomers are not human) but 
I'm rooting enough for Kari that I hope she succeeds here.

I tried to clarify by differentiating between how Sylia sees Kari and 
how she treats Kari, so let me reiterate: I do not hope that Kari can 
be seen as a human, but that (at least for now) she can be treated as 
one (since that's what she's comfortable with and wants).

I can see the possibility for hypocrisy in my opinion, but would need 
more discussion before I'm bothered by it; hypocrisy is not highest on 
the list of vices I detest.

>>> Considering my recent encounters with Sylvie and Anri I realized it would
>>> be frighteningly easy to disassociate myself from a humanities point of
>>> view.
>>
>> Slight confusion here: "from a humanities point of view" means what
>> exactly? I'm used to "humanities" meaning "the study of humanity" (often in
>> a college setting, which is where Kari is). I think you meant "from
>> humanity's point of view", as Sylvie and Anri are separated from humanity's
>> perspective.
>
> It should have been from a human  not humanities.  Probably a change in
> the sentance didn't fix that going from humanties to a human.
>
> Which do you think is better?  "from humanity's" or "from a human"?

Ah, ok, that makes sense.
Let me see how they look:
"it would be easy to disassociate myself from humanity's point of view"
"it would be easy to disassociate myself from a human point of view"

I think they're identical in meaning, and... mostly identical in 
subtext/connotation.
the first one sounds a bit more philosophical, but also feels a bit 
more like she's intentionally referring to the "us versus them" 
conflict she's been talking about.

Maybe "from the human point of view"?

I don't have a strong feeling either way.

>>> Already time spent with the others had me dividing the world into us and
>>> them.  It was a distinction that I hadn't even dwelt on before.  How much
>>> greater would the divide get over time?  Would I even consider myself a
>>> person?  Or more ethically worrying would it grow until I no longer felt
>>> bound by the same social conventions that humanity is?
>>
>> Good, she's finally getting to think about this some more xD
>
> Hopefully at the same time that the internal divide is going away!

Interesting point. Is she really moving from her old group of "I'm a 
human!" to seeing that being a 33-S is a valid, but different, 
culture/group/identity?
I hadn't caught that as such until just now.

>>   I stumbled out of the cloying masses at the next station.  I felt sick.
>>>   Even
>>> the possibilities I had contemplated refusing to leave me alone.  As I
>>> staggered away from the subway and into the laughably 'cleaner' air of the
>>> inner city I realized how fast my heart was racing.  Aware of it I could
>>> damp down the physiological signs of stress subconsciously fighting the
>>> haze of pheromones had caused.
>>
>> Yeah, a crowded subway is NOT a good place for her to be doing thinking
>> like that :/
>
> Look she's getting better at riding the subway!

Hah!
Not what I had in mind, but perhaps it suits her better...
Now I'm starting to root for her to figure out what she really is and 
make the most of it :D

>>> So it was walking with a confident stride, despite the eyes it drew, that
>>> I
>>> approached the entrance to the Silky Doll.  The confidence building
>>> justification I repeated in my mind was a little different than I had ever
>>> used before.  –*I am a beautiful, desirable woman and I am in
>>> control.-*
>>
>> ...She's going for a meeting with *Sylia* of all people and she's trying
>> that? Feels like she's playing Sylia's game before the game even starts,
>> and that's generally a bad idea...
>
> That implies Sylia has feelings. :p

Oh, did it?
Well, I'm *assuming* Sylia has feelings, pretty sure she's still that 
much human. (having just watched BGC2040 recently, I'm not sure how 
transhuman she is here but I think this is a safe bet)
;p

She doesn't like showing them much, but she has feelings. Anger and 
revenge may top that list, crowding out much room for emotion on other 
subjects, but yeah ;)


>>> Psyching myself up for a high stress meeting I let that truth sink in. I
>>> was going in, I could do this; just don't let them see you sweat!
>>>
>>> The smile I gave him was almost vulpine.  It was clear he had been told I
>>> was coming, -*Subject expecting us due to lack of indicators for surprise
>>> 89% probable.*- However whatever he might have anticipated my stepping
>>> right up and flirting shamelessly wasn't among them.
>>
>> Hah. I *am* curious to see what Sylia does with this, she won't be
>> unaware...
>
> Well what do you think of Sylia's method of keeping Kari in line as far as
> her brother is concerned?

Shoot. I think it was *very* Sylia; I don't know whether she really 
knows how well it'll work, nor do I think I really know how well it'll 
work.

Considering the time she's spending with Naomi and the other 33-Ss...
I think that Kari sees Mackie as "safe" and she's more testing her own 
limits and what the 33-S side of her personality is like.

I'd be more worried about keeping Mackie leashed, honestly, but I 
don't *really* think he has enough contact with Kari to matter.

Besides, he works as an attendant at a lingerie shop? Kari isn't the 
one I'm worried about -laughs-

>>> Laughing slightly I took a quick moment to stuff the lingerie set into my
>>> backpack.  It was a small gesture, but pilfering like this made me feel
>>> rebellious.  It wasn't as if Sylia couldn't afford the loss and even if it
>>> weren't true it gave me the illusion that I wasn't worried about what she
>>> might do even if she did, as was probable, have a camera in here to watch
>>> me.
>>
>> Maybe you'll just owe her later?  >_>
>
> Or prove she's a little more human than boomer, or prove she has no morals
> and is more boomer than human.  That gesture can be taken a lot of differnt
> ways.

And Sylia will take it whichever way best suits her ends. -sigh-
I'd rather just owe her later, it's cleaner >_<

>>> Already I thought?  I took a breath and let my instincts take over.
>>> Settling
>>> into the sofa my body relaxed.  My posture softened as I stopped trying to
>>> match her professionalism, instincts smoothing out my own responses and
>>> making my gestures more graceful and natural.  I did notice a slight quirk
>>> in her brow as she poured my tea in response, but as she decided not to
>>> bring it up neither did I.
>>
>> Told ya. Don't play high-pressure business meeting with Sylia; it's her
>> playground and you're not dressed for it.
>
> Nope, even with all her advantages she doesn't have nearly a good enough
> read on Sylia to try and play that game.  Luckily she has some practice
> with Sylvie and Anri at using a sub band for communicating extra
> information, even if she can't pick up a response.

Yeah, this was an interesting meeting. Hopefully Kari got a lot out of 
it, I'm just not sure if the part I think were important for her are 
the parts that she thinks were important, heh.

Though a lot of that is in retrospect on my part, so I'm cheating again.

>>> Finally she broke the silence, her voice coming out cool, without
>>> inflection.
>>
>> Kari managed to get Sylia to speak first, so that's a point to Kari. :D
>
> Actually I just decided that Sylia didn't care enough to draw things out
> further.  She recognized what Kari had done and decided she didn't want to
> try dealing with the 33-S but instead the person.  Drawing out a contest of
> wills against 33-S programing is meaningless.

Yeah, but remember Kari is playing Sylia's game here, so Sylia still 
gave Kari that point.
Or does Kari win the point herself, for getting Sylia to try to deal 
with her as a person?

>>> "I am not yet willing to discuss that subject."
>>
>> Interesting... so what subject does she wish to discuss first?
>
> See, she wants to deal with Kari about Kari, not with a 33-S about other
> 33-S's

:)
I think I was noting that Sylia just meant it's later on the agenda... 
and then Kari seems to think she means it's not on the table at all.

>>>  Exasperatingly she remained absolutely calm.
>>
>> Sylia does that xD
>>
> Its kind of her defining character trait.  If she gets visibly angery be
> afraid.

She's the type to get cold-angry first, too, so it's not always easy 
to tell.

>> I have a hard time seeing Sylia as "unfair" but I think Kari has a good
>> point: *these* murderers have a VERY good chance of being rehabilitated.
>
> Why do you say that about Sylia?  Did I give the impression that she was
> going to be unfair?

Quite the opposite: I was quoting Kari from a couple paragraphs 
previous, and trying to say that I have a hard time agreeing with her 
assessment of Sylia.

> What she's really trying to do is get some guarantees
> that she won't be making a mistake if she does let Kari and the others get
> off without punishment.  It's also a not so veiled excuse/explaination to
> readers for why I think they should be accepting of Kari's plans as just,
> without handwaving away the fact of the crimes.

Kari is explaining her position to Sylia, just as you are explaining 
it to the readers. And if she can't get Sylia to accept it, why should we?
It's the same argument, different speakers/audience. No complaints 
from me :D

>>> So I bulled onward before she could interrupt. "I will admit I
>>> resorted to enlightened self-interest as a short-cut but it's
>>> hard to skip straight to other philosophies of ethics when
>>> their world experience is both so limited and of the nature
>>> they have endured.
>>
>> I personally think that enlightened self-interest works pretty well--and
>> more developed human-centric ethics may not apply very well to 33-Ses, or
>> at least they may not see it that way.
>
> I agree.  And yes you called the enlightened self interest earlier.  That
> had me smiling.  It is a pretty good philosophy for a boomer.  And as Kari
> says, trying to integrate them with another system of ethics would be
> tricky and take a lot more time.

I admit, I cheated--I had read through this a couple days before I got 
to respond. The previous mention was mostly to see if you were 
intentionally being consistent about it :)

>>> Sylia rose to her feet, and I couldn't help but notice again just how much
>>> taller than me everyone else was.  "Yes, it will not be long.  I already
>>> have its specifications and it will not take long to make the
>>> arrangements.
>>> I expect that sometime this evening would be most appropriate."
>>
>> For not wanting to talk about it that's pretty fast...  -paranoid-
>> OTOH that's a good reason not to talk about it first. Get the *difficult*
>> stuff out of the way, then deal with the easy stuff.
>
> Well you might not remember, but Sylia does have a commission to retrieve
> the DD.  So even while she's not showing it there is a little girl
> inside doing the moonwalk over getting her hands on it so easily.

Mm. OK, did not remember that bit. I knew there was a reason I wasn't 
concerned about her accepting the offer, though >_<

I still think it makes a great excuse for saving that till the end of 
the meeting, it's just an inconsequential formality ^_^

>>> Just before the doors began to close Sylvia said one more thing.  "Oh and
>>> Kari, stick to black.  White would make you look 16.  I doubt you want
>>> Mackie to think you are available."  Then they shut with a click.
>>
>> HAH!
>> This may be the most humorous version of Sylvia I have ever seen. I
>> approve :)
>
> I was trying for a dry wit, I hope I succeeded.

That is exactly how I'm reading it. Now quit making me identify with 
Sylia so much! I can't afford a hardsuit!

>> Feels like a good way to end the chapter, too.
>>
> Oh, well thats actually really good then.  I was thinking of going
> further, but as I consider it maybe your right and all the action can be
> done next chapter leaving this one entirely charachter building.

Sounds good to me!

> Hopefully I won't go 4 months again. This really was a tough chapter to get
> my head around as my characters had escaped my plans and I had to wrangle
> everything back into place. That's hopefully now all been achived and I can
> move on from here more quickly.

Yeah, character development will do that.
I intend to be here when you get the next one posted :)
(And don't forget to post the final version here so I can see what 
other changes you made as well!)

-Strike & Co.
-- 
Rule # 1: There are always exceptions to the rules.