Okay, I would have preferred to send this to you via private email. That
proved impossible, however, since you left no email address that I could
see. C'est la vie.
This is mostly Chris, AKA Blade, who has not actually read Insertion.
Aaron, AKA Epsilon, will occasionally have comments as well.
Snipping will be frequent... no offence, but you repeated several complaints
many, many times.
For some strange, strange reason, despite the plaintext attachment, your
formatting really sucks. Not only is this irritating for the
Actually, no, it's more that the formatting is intended for a website. It
would also work well for a book. For the FFML and fanfiction.net, not so
much. Unfortunately, but we've tried multiple ways to correct the problem
and this is actually the best that could be come up with.
reader, it's also annoying to the C&Cer. Find a solution to that, because
as I've mentioned, formatting errors kills more fics than... Self...
Insert... content.
That is why we included a link to our webpage. It looks FABulous there. It
also looks good on anifics.
Kya-ha. ^^; The quote is _doubly_ applicable to you, author-san. As a
disclaimer, I won't be bashing your fic because it's basically SI.
That's... kind of a promise you didn't keep. ;p
I'm sure you've heard it before, but (whispers) readers generally don't
like SIs unless it's a Carrot fic. Besides, as an blatantly SI author, I'm
sure you've heard of the age-old argument:
Not only have we heard of it, we pretty much blatently say it in a) our
description of the fic on the website, and b) our author's notes in the
first chapter explicated part of the point of the story.
Anyway, I will also not be bashing your fic because of its Linkin
Parkedness. My musical preferences and bias against SI fics are
There is no particularly Linkin Parkedness to the fanfic. It was what Aaron
was listening to when he came up with some of the concepts, so it's used as
a nifty naming scheme. That's it. As a bonus, the book names (that you
didn't see) are based on Chris De Burgh albums.
Extra! Extra! Catch it here first, folks! This is your one and only chance
to
get THE straight scoop. One hundred percent pure authorial oversight
perception
The word "authorial oversight perception" gives me a headache. Is it any
different from "Sentient Narrative Prose"? Because I have a feeling it's
not, as evidenced by the way the prose is presented.
Actually, this is Ran talking directly to the audience in a completely
out-of-continuity bit that's at the beginning of every chapter where a
character talks to the audience about what happened last chapter, as was
requested by some of our readers due to the month-long gap between chapters.
is what this plucky reporter has been granted, and since these meanies
tell
me
I'm going to lose it soon, I better make it count!
Your humble narrator, the beautiful and eloquent Ran Hibiki, has found
(eyebrow twitching) Oooh. It's... _her_. Speaking. In first person. I
haven't seen _this_ before. 9_9
BTW, Ran Hibiki isn't a "new character". She is a character from a series.
She has no relationship to Ryouga Hibiki, nor to Dan Hibiki (who also has no
relation to Ryouga), nor to any Hibiki from any other series, ever.
You would, of course, know this if you had read the series. Or looked at
the webpage.
let it slide because of the nature of your story. As a side-note, you're
definitely using the tell not show side of things. I too
Again, not to put too fine a point on it, but... no duh. That's the point
of this. To tell, not show. It is a narrative recap of significant events.
If you want to be shown, read said previous chapters.
tricking Ryouga into thinking he raped her.
Nabiki: Shooting fish out of a barrel.
Reader: Ahahahaha! Nabiki's tricking Ryoga by making him think that he
raped her! Ahaha--(laughter stops, dead silence)......
Yeah, funny how that's not supposed to be funny, huh?
This fic has the same amount of irreverence and supposed
"This fic", at the point you are talking, has not started yet. It should,
in fact, be blatently obvious, since even if you haven't read anything
before this (which you haven't), it should be quite clear that a character
talking about having been given authorial omniscience and narrating about
what happened is not something that happened in the fanfic. Frankly, I'm
unsure as to how precisely that could have confused you so. But no matter,
forging onwards.
Also, and I believe this is a fair warning I always issue before I dive
headfirst C&Cing a fic, I'll give you my first impressions. You may already
know this, but the way your chapters are titled and the name of the story
itself can be off-putting to people, and it's not
You are precisely the second reader to actually notice (or at least mention)
it, and the first one actually was just some guy who said, paraphrased:
"Wow, I wonder if the fic's as good as the album? I haven't read it yet.
Kthxbye."
Thus, I am not particularly worried. It is merely a naming scheme, because
naming schemes add a neat sort of continuity to a work. If we had stolen
the titles of 18th Century poetry for the chapters, would that somehow be
better? I don't see why.
The chapter titles connote nothing other than the actual words used.
"Hybrid Theory" is called that because it is an appropriate name, referring
as it does to the hybrid nature of the main character.
I don't really care what anybody thinks about Linkin Park, because the fic
has as much to do with Linkin Park as it does with Dance Dance Revolution,
Waterproof Blonde, Yoko Kanno, Zebrahead, Aerosmith, Asia, Billy Joel,
Bjork, Goo Goo Dolls, or any of the many, many other things that have been
listened to when writing it.
"Well, do so next time, you lummox," Ran snickered as she rapped his
Lummox? Who uses that language? For something that promotes a false
Plenty of people. Including, as it seems, Ran Hibiki.
"Yes," Ran giggled.
"Oh." Ranma nodded. "Just checking."
(shrug) The humor, so far, isn't quite working for me. Oh well.
That's actually banter, not humour.
"Us?" Ran blinked.
"Yeah, us," Ranma frowned. "You want a scoop, right?" Ranma smirked and
rolled his neck.
Who is he, Dhalsim? How does a person 'roll' his neck, anyway?
You roll your neck by stretching such that it and your head roll 360 degrees
on your shoulders. It is a colloquial expression. Similarly, you do not
actually break anything when you crack your knuckles.
"I..." Ran trailed off oddly. Ranma looked over at her and saw she was
Ran: (clasps her hands together while looking at the sky, sparkles
surrounding her)
I know subtlety isn't the strong point of this fic, but there are times
when subtlety really is called for, even for fics such as this. Hitting the
reader in the head with blatant clues on plot points that don't really add
much to the humor or _anything_ of the fic will result in reader fanfic
headache. Symptoms include, "disbelief over what the story allegedly is
telling" and "shooting pain whenever the obvious is stated once again".
It's not supposed to be subtle. Romances between anime characters virtually
never are. The readers are supposed to pick up on it.
By the by: in this fanfic, Ranma never fell in love with, or was engaged to,
Akane. Nor did he fall in love with anyone else. If that's why you think
him and Ran having a romance is unbelievable... you are now better informed.
"Yeah," Ranma nodded seriously. Their conversation paused
Conversations don't have siestas or end by themselves. People pause in the
middle of conversations, not the other way around. And it's nevertheless an
awkward use of a personification that came out of nowhere if you're going
for that.
Conversations are things. They can pause, much like a battle can pause,
despite the fact that in a technical sense, they can't. It is common
colloquial English to refer to a pause in conversation. "A pregnant pause
in conversation" is a fairly common idiom, as well.
"Yes," Ranma nodded. "Just because I'm better than Ukyou doesn't mean I
can't learn from... him." Ranma swished his tongue around in his mouth,
searching for the right way to say what he meant. "I respect Ukyou, as a
fighter. He may not be as good as me... but he has the same spirit. The
same
drive to win. Maybe even more. The people Ukyou has fights with are...
good.
Real good. They're tricky and strong. Yet... Ukyou wins. Not by being
strong
or
tough, but by sheer force of will.
Joem: Such is the proper way to fight. Of course, it's not the proper way
to win at all.
By thinking fast and never giving up, ya
know?" Ranma wasn't sure if he was getting across, so he tried rephrasing
it
one
more time. "When I win, it's because I'm better than my opponent. When
Ukyou
wins... it's because she wants it more than the other guy." Ranma nodded.
Joem: The only way to defeat an opponent superior to you in every way is to
negate his/her superiority. This is difficult to do. Luckily, a lot of the
strongest fighters do it to themselves, saving you the trouble.
Y'know, I've been harping on and on about your SI that it makes me
wonder... Where the hell is he/she? Is he Ranma? Is she Ran? For an
He/she isn't in this particular chapter very much, due to events previous to
this chapter.
Of course, there is another self-insert. But one of them isn't the main
character.
SI fic, this sure strangely has a decisive lack of SI. To think I was all
prepared to make a Self Extraction joke as soon as I spot the SI. Boo!
False advertising!
*pat pat*
"That's why I respect Ukyou's skill. That's the talent I want to pick up."
>From the amazing things I've already seen you do, this is a rather humble
view of yourself, Ranma. Most, if not all of your opponents were, in way or
another, better than you. Anime and Manga. You
Ranma's opponents include Genma, Shampoo, and Ryouga. The first he has
steadily started surpassing. The other two, he owned for free. He hasn't
even fought Kunou. Therefore, yes, he is quite within his experience to
state he wins because he is better.
Of course, the Ranma from the manga would also say he won all of his fight
against all of his opponents because he was better.
didn't simply power up and defeat the opponents as you allege, you found
their weaknesses and exploited them with extreme prejudice. Defeating an
opponent through 'sheer willpower' is a myth
You are reading more into that phrase than was stated, because you don't
know anything about the incidents which Ranma was referring to. And that's
really all I have to say about it.
"I see..." Ran trailed off again. "Wait, did you just say 'she'?"
Nitpick: In Japanese, 'she' as a pronoun doesn't exist. Let me
I am aware of this. But we are writing in English, for an English audience.
Chris hopped down from the rooftop and began walking along the street.
(Final Fantasy victory trumpet call plays in the background) The
self-insert has finally arrived!
....And his name is Chris. (muted trumpet) ~Wah wah wah...~
Perhaps you think it would have been "cooler" if I'd called myself "Blade".
"Why are we slowing down, over?" An irritated tone; that one on the
left would be Link, then.
She has a walky-talky?
I'll address your complaint once.
Pink and Link are characters from the Ranma 1/2 manga, Japanese Volume 29.
That is how they talk: as if they are constantly speaking over
walkie-talkies. In fact, we have for the sake of easy reading reduced the
frequency of the "overs", which in the manga end every singhle sentence,
exclamation, involuntary sound, and written message. In here, it merely
ends every dialogue.
I'm sorry you don't like it. You should probably take it up with Rumiko
Takahashi.
always running around saving people from Pink's poisons. She'd even saved
Ranma's life twice in the manga...granted, once was when she didn't know
the
female Ranma was 'Shampoo's husband', and once was to save her own skin,
but
still. Link was essentially a good person, unlike her sister. She was no
Akane, but it still bothered him how much she disliked him. Was his very
existence that distasteful to her?
Well, whaddyaknow? Your self-insert is strangely acting like a C&Cer giving
detailed critique on the Ranma 1/2 manga while blatantly inserting all
his/the author's opinions on the good, the bad and the skinny of the work.
He's putting his bias into the work
Yes, Chris is actually acting like a C&Cer blatently inserting all his
opinions on the good, bad and skinny of the work. Good catch on that, it's
a good way of putting it.
He glanced around as the poison-loving twin did her work. Nobody seemed
to be around other than the police; cleared out, or was this just not a
popular
spot for drunken salarymen?
Suggest: salary men
You just did a lecture on Japanese, but want me to make salarymen two words?
Tsk.
Incidentally, you make a lot of corrections which basically are "make this
one word two words with a hypehn". At least once, I agree. All the other
times, it's perfectly acceptable colloquial English, which blurs together
words with considerable frequency.
one of the small boats, he and the twins climbed in. Good thing he could
drive
a boat.
If it's a boat that can be driven, then shouldn't it be mentioned that it's
a speedboat as opposed to a sailboat or a boat with paddles? There are more
than one kind of boat, y'know.
If it's a boat that can be DRIVEN, it has an engine.
Moreover, it's a police boat, and I figure readers can probably guess that
it's not a sailboat, given that.
Styming is not a word.
Yes it is. A word is used by speakers of the English language, and thusforth
it is a word, and no amounts of complaining about the properness of said
word will change that fact.
all attempts by Kusanagi and the TAC to
defeat it until Matsudaira (the scientist) had come up with the idea to
solidify
its mostly-liquid form with a large quantity of the polymers they used in
diapers to solidify liquid waste, thus rendering it able to be destroyed.
(snickers) Rendering it 'able to be destroyed'? How about rendering it
'destroyable'? Wait, skip that suggestion, it sounds lame... How about
rendering it 'powerless' or rendering it 'helpless' or something?
Not an accurate description of what happened. It literally was rendered
"able to be destroyed", not "powerless" or "helpless". Plus, I generally
narrate and speak in elevated diction, because I am an arrogant git.
He'd
at first been thinking that he'd get some large bags of salt to do a
similar
trick, but Pink and Link pooh-poohed the idea upon hearing it.
Pooh-poohed? What do you mean by pooh-poohed? Do you mean 'shat'? Is
"Pooh-poohed" is another colloquial term, which is basically means "to say
no to a proposal". It contains connotations of ridiculousness. For
instance, if your boss pooh-poohs your business proposal, it means he not
only said no, but did so in such a fashion that it implied the proposal was
ludicrous.
May I ask where you live? You seem to be unfamiliar with a LOT of
colloquial English.
this yet another in-joke that went past my head? Because, IMO, a humor
piece where I have no idea which part I'm supposed to laugh isn't a very
good humor piece.
It is neither an in-joke, nor a joke. Just a description. And Hybrid
Theory isn't a humour piece, though it does contain humour.
mitama easy pickings.
'mitama' means what?
Something you would know if you had read the previous chapters.
Essentially, it is a glowing blue seed about the size of a thumb which is a
crystallised soul for an aragami. It then inhabits another living organism
(plant, animal, bacterium, etc.) and is able to mutate that creature's form
to its needs. Origin is the series Blue Seed.
"I'll
make sure of it, but you two be careful. Remember, that thing has lots of
tentacles to attack with, and it's acidic enough to eat through steel." It
was
true...as they drew nearer the afflicted cruise ship, he saw the dark
shape
looming over the bow. The metal there was quite damaged from the
creature's
corrosive form, the hull eroded and split. Not down to the waterline yet,
though.
Nitpick: As I am wont to emphasize 'show not tell' (Though I myself have
trouble applying it... Just how do you do it, Mr. McSpon? You make it seem
so easy...), I will say this: You don't need a character of yours to state
the obvious. Link and Pink have eyes, after all. And if you do need your
character (out of spite, I dunno...) to say what he said, then you need not
show the character demonstrating what he just said. Simple enough. It's
either show or tell, not both, IMO.
It's telling because a) I'm observing the ship, and those are my
observations, and b) because neither Pink nor Link would give a shit.
Describing a scene is not really something frowned upon in prose, generally.
The orange-skinned man was
Hey, is this one of those NES-age villains that glow orange when their
nearing death or unconsciousness? Or is Kusanagi in one of his 'cute' moods
right now, glowing red after hitting one of his cheap-ass supers?
No, Kusanagi is a character who has orange skin.
He paused, then added sarcastically, "If that's
okay?"
I have no idea why he doesn't just do as he said. Of course, I have
Because my immediately preceding dialogue had me faux-politely asking his
permission, and thus Kusanagi sarcastically replied in kind.
Well, that was easier than he'd expected. Grinning, he leaped back onto
the superstructure of the cruise ship. "Bring it, carrot-boy!"
SI that knows most of everything there is to know about everyone in the
fic... Check. Just once, I'd like to see a guy that absolutely has no idea
what's going on in the crazy world of Japanese cartoons in written form.
Was done, by SKJAM: "Ma Vie Et Roses".
and began to remove those she saw as worthless for
the
current situation, while replacing them with ones she thought applied
more.
Pink
mimicked her actions, correcting Link's mistakes even as Link corrected
hers.
Heh. One step forward, two steps backwards. Your first comedic situation
that actually worked. Or I could be wrong and the twins were actually being
meticulous about their selections. (ponders)
Bingo on the last part.
"Hmm, I'm not sure about that, over..."
"You're right! It'll need to defend itself against the attacks of the
aragami. So we mix in a little venus flytrap. You know, to eat the
tentacles,
over."
Quaint. Maybe I was wrong. Maybe I shouldn't be expecting a comedy. Or a
drama. Perhaps I should instead be expecting some action? Maybe there'll be
a little bit of everything in this fic. Nevertheless, I can't seem to find
a point of interest in your fic that I'd actually find interesting, but
that's just me. Y'see, Pink and Link are the comedy gold twins. Their
antics and personalities have so much
It's fascinating how you have decided that for us.
Pink and Link are people, who happen to have several humourous/strange
character traits. That does not mean they cannot do something meticulously,
nor that they could be serious when the situation calls for it.
The fact they are not merely one-note jokes simply because they are minor
manga characters, that in fact they have personalities, desires and
character traits that go beyond that, was yet another of those things in the
previous chapter.
"Hey, earth to Ran," Ranma snapped her fingers in front of Ran's face.
"We're on the other side of the ship and if I want to, ya know, save the
day
and
everything... we'll have to go that-a-way." Ranma jerked her thumb towards
the
curve of the ship's hull.
I think it needs to be noted since I'm already in page twelve of this
so-far thirty-three page C&C... The pacing of this fic sucks. To think,
this is even just the first half. The length of this chapter is indeed
notable, but so far from what I've seen not much is really going on. It's
going at a snail's dragging pace. Nothing much is really happening. The
line in between significant plot point A to significant plot point B isn't
a straight line, but a really squiggly one that tends to meander and beat
around the bush.
You know what? You might be right.
But if you are? You would have no clue that you were.
You do not know the characters, the situations, the events leading to this,
or what may or may not be significant. You are unaware of what
relationships exist, why they exist, or what has happened to make them
exist. You are, in other words, completely capable of missing extremely
major plot points due to the fact you lack the knowledge to notice "hey,
that was character development!"
Perhaps you are right; perhaps the pacing could have used adjustment. But
it's hard to take your word for it, since you have no idea what is or isn't
significant.
"I thought I told you-"
Ran was cut off by a pair of feminine shrieks of pure terror. You know,
the kind that always filled the soundtracks of horror films.
(shrug) No laughs from me here. This kind of humor is typical of bad and
IMO unfunny fics where author asides are rampant and are used as a pathetic
attempt at humor. Sentient Narrative Prose, as I call it. Better authors
can pull this off, but better authors also have the common sense not to use
it for an entire chapter or an entire fic.
Here is where it will be necessary to inform you that this fanfic is not
written in third-person omniscient viewpoint, but rather in third person
limited viewpoint. I'm not sure how you missed that, but there is it
regardless.
That is not an authorial aside. It is an aside by Ran Hibiki. She speaks
as if speaking to an audience, because she is a gung-ho newspaper reporter,
and that is how she thinks and talks. She also makes frequent analogies and
references to pop culture. Whether it is funny or not (it's not supposed to
be funny, really) is beside the point: that is how the character thinks.
By the by, I might as well hit this one too: lots of Japanese know what
Cthulu is. They are more familiar with American pop culture than you think.
While I certainly wouldn't suggest replacing this part with purplish prose,
this descriptive part of your fic still sticks out like a sore thumb... a
sore thumb which the narrative describes in full... every last blister,
every last hairy wart, and every last pus-filled, scabbed wounds. The
Sentient Narrative Prose goes hand in hand with gratuitous descriptions to
create... this monster of a paragraph that, as far as I know, adds nothing
to the story. Not that I have any idea what _could_ be added to the story
since looks nothing more to me than an SNL sketch gone bad, but....
You missed the point that the already extant giant monster mutated into this
horrible thing because of what Pink and Link did, and the description
references at every turn the earlier references to what Pink and Link were
splicing together in order to kill it.
With a final grunt, Ranma flipped clear of the Cthuloid Monstrosity's
reach. She spun elegantly, landing with a flourish directly in front of
Ran.
Somehow, she had twisted the two girls out of their vicelike grips on her
Suggest: vice-like
For fun, I'll note this is the one I agree with you on; that was a typo on
my part. Or Aaron's; I don't really remember.
"Hey, this is a great shot!" Ranma complained.
"I'm a reporter, not a PR rep, Ranma," Ran pointed out. Then she took
the picture anyway.
"Hey, you're not Chris, over!" the one on the right shouted accusingly.
"Who are you, over?" Lefty added.
"Are you trying to steal my mitama, over?" Righty continued.
Please give the comedic designs of Mr. Sentient Narrative Prose his
well-earned cymbal clash. He could be a regular in Comedy Central. Ahahaha.
Lefty-Righty, he say, instead of Pink and Link, over. What a comic genius.
Ran does not refer to Pink and Link by their names because she does not know
their names. She also cannot refer to them by a gross physical difference
(say, "the red-haired one and the black-haired one") because they are
identical twins wearing nearly-identical outfits. Therefore she used the
most obvious differentiating point available to her: what side of Ranma they
are on.
Once again, I'm not exactly sure why you thought that was supposed to be a
joke. I get the feeling you were expecting this fic to be something it
isn't, and persist with the idea it is that thing despite a lack of evidence
to support it.
"What? I'm busy!" Ranma shouted back.
"Monster!" Ran pointed.
"Oh, right," all three said simultaneously.
(cue laugh track)
<shrug> Is that supposed to be sarcasm? If you don't find it mildly
amusing, that's certainly within your rights... but it is humour that would
fit right into Ranma 1/2 and many, many other anime/manga/video games. If
it fell flat to you... I suppose we didn't write something you would find
funny. Our bad.
"STOP SITTING DOWN AND MOVING SO FAST, YOU JERK!" Kusanagi spat as the
~_~ Uh, right. How funny. And by funny, I mean weird and un-humorous.
Gee, why not rip an SI of his powers and his magical ability to speak
Japanese so that the fic won't sound contrived, cliche and generally
unoriginal?
Fun fact: Chris didn't know Japanese until he murdered someone in an
airport, stole their body, and used it to learn it. He later gained better
command by murdering an actual Japanese police officer, who of course knew
it better.
As simple test for me to assess characterization viability is to see if an
original character/author avatar/self insert/hell, even a canon character
can add to the story without having uber-powers. If they can, then they
have good characterization. If the character can add to the story by means
of _presence_ alone that even if he doesn't talk (hence the lack of
knowledge in Japanese), he can still add to the story, then he's one of
those rare, charming and non-annoying characters who can actually stand
equal ground to the main character. But usually, it's enough for me to know
that an OC/SI is well-characterized enough to be interesting and cool
without creating ki-dragons of eternity that destroy the very essence of
their enemies, thus making them demi-gods of ficdom.
Sometimes the point of a villain is that they are difficult to defeat. It
is hard to do this in Ranma 1/2 without giving someone uber-powers, and
Ranma 1/2 isn't the biggest gun on the block.
radar tower tumbled down behind him. The boy was smirking at him and
sitting
only a few meters away, looking calm and collected in his jeans and black
t-
shirt. Kusanagi was beginning to hate that insufferable grin, and most of
the
face it was attached to.
Readers: (cheering for Kusanagi)
Good!
Even if you're taking great lengths to portray Kusanagi as weak and
pathetic to the point of becoming Kuwabara-like, the presence of the
annoying SI that doesn't even deserve to breathe the same breath as
It's a good thing he doesn't, then. ;p
the other characters would probably goad them to cheer Kusanagi. I mean,
they're both tedious and annoying characters, but at least the amount of
suckage Kusanagi is nothing to the black-hole-like suckage power your SI
Chris has.
With all due respect, it's not like your comments on Chris come from an
understanding of the character, since you have some sort of strange notion
that he is a) a protagonist, and b) the story revolves around him, or c)
that you are supposed to sympathise with/cheer for/support him.
Your SI character seems to be quite the stereotypical self insert.
Funny, that.
pacing). Secondly, effective self-inserts are usually parodies of the
genre. They have something new to offer. Even though the design
Aaron: No they aren't. Alan Harnum did the best parody of that self-insert
genre. Everything else, including the work of Carrot Glace, is a pale
imitation. Nothing he has done, including "Insertion", has added to the
genre. True, "Insertion" is funny, but it is not particularly innovative.
Hybrid Theory isn't attempting to parody the genre, but to deconstruct it
(amongst other things).
itself is flawed, at the very least these innovative SIs (oxymoron, I know,
but work with me here) can still make these kind of fics work.
Thirdly, the characterization. To your credit, none of the characters were
horribly lobotomized save for Ukyo who has the 'self-insert-in-my-head'
syndrome. But none of them are particularly interesting or likeable either.
Ranma reads like the typical, 'likeable', honorable guy who appreciates the
hard work of a fellow martial artist and charms the ladies without even
realizing it. In
So, in other words, he's in character. He IS likable, and vaguely
honourable. He DOES appreciate the hard work of fellow martial artists. He
DOES charm women without realising it.
Thank you!
fact, if I didn't know any better, I'd say Ranma's the third self-insert of
this fic... the 'I'm so honorable and nice I should be hired in a Disney
Lead role, save for the fact that I can change into a girl' variety of
Ranma-SI. Ran, the Pink-Link connection, and
Of course, that's kinda bullshit. Also, you complain later about us making
him a gullible moron. You can't have it both ways: either we're perfecting
him, or we're not. Pick one complaint and stick with it.
the rest of the characters who might as well be nameless are all very
uninteresting as characters.
You know, it may not be the point of this particular scene in Chapter 10 of
the fanfic to characterise Pink, Link, or Ran. Just throwing that out
there.
Seriously, the characterization sucks not because it's inaccurate, but
because the character's portrayal leaves the reader uninterested most of
the time. I mean, aside from annoying the reader with repetitive 'over'
catchphrases and being there for the sole purpose of listening to Ranma so
that he won't monologue to himself about how Ukyo's admirable and how he's
going to save the world again, what good has these characters done? Your
fic is cluttered with
Okay, you know what? I'm getting a leeetle tired of this tack, so I'm gonna
be more blunt.
Ran falling in love with Ranma, aside from being something that was built up
over several chapters, is fricking significant.
Pink and Link are there for moderate comic relief and because they are ones
who are responsible for this entire event happening.
Kusanagi is here because he was here, at this point, fighting this aragami,
exactly as he was, and Ran/Ranma and Chris/Pink/Link are now showing up and
interfering with the events as they would have occured in the Blue Seed
anime.
Everybody is here for a reason.
flat, lackluster and tiresome characters that don't pique reader interest
or sympathy at all. Ranma's the most characterized of the characters, but
unfortunately he's also the most cliche, which
And I will be blunt here, too: you have not read enough of this fanfic
(ignoring the last 9 chapters you skipped, you've barely even started this
one) to hold an informed opinion on any character. It would be similar to
if I read five pages of chapter 24 of Waters Under Earth and immediately
started complaining that Dr. Tofu's was out of character and Ranma was
unbelievable heroic.
I might be right! But if I was, it would be through no fault of my own.
If our character are flat, lackluster, undercharacterised, etc... that's a
problem. But it is a problem you are completely and totally incapable of
rendering a judgement as to the existence of. Not that this is stopping
you, but that's why my nerves are starting to grate a little.
I do appreciate you taking time to comment; it's effort put in, and I
appreciate that on principle, which is why I am exercising effort to
respond. But I cannot for the life of me understand why you decided to
start with a two-month-old chapter of a fanfic which by your own admission
you went in with the intention to dislike due to its concept, then promptly
started complaining about the depth of character's characterisation when you
have read a brief amount of material including them. Not to mention making
wild, unwarranted assumptions (such as Ran being a "new character", Chris
being a protagonist, where in the series it is, or that Pink and Link say
"over" for no reason) in a rather accusatory fashion.
personality and sans motivation. 'They just want to have fun while saving
the world and acting 'honorably'' is the general motivation for these
people. But really, who would act honorably when given super powers?
Whatever happened to 'absolute power corrupts absolutely'? Is it really a
person's first instinct to use his powers for good or is it more believable
that a person would make use of their powers for self-gain and revenge
against those that, in their eyes, have done them wrong?
SI: But if I do that, then I'd look like the bad guy!
Yeah. Funny, that.
At least you'd be an honest bad guy, ne? And there's the fanservice of
seeing an SI get beaten up to a pulp by the main character, which is always
cool.
If you want to see an SI beaten up, read the previous nine chapter. There's
plenty of the actual SI protagonist getting the shit kicked out of him/her.
There's also plenty of it in chapter 11 and 12.
It has the typical self-insert good guy who has squash matches (uneven
matches where the SI is clearly the victor) simply by the
Not so far it hasn't, since while Kusanagi has not done serious damage to
me, I have also yet to do serious damage to him.
I will also refer you to the fact that I was obviously extremely wary of
getting into a fight with Ranma,
virtue of seeing and reading about the guy he's fighting with in a
comic/video game/anime and having uber-abilities he pulled out of the air.
And, as if the SI element in the story isn't annoying
I didn't pull them out of thin air. I killed Sentarou and am wearing his
body, using his skills and knowledge. And that of Kodachi, since I murdered
her earlier. By the by, you can stop referring to me as a "good guy" now.
The retort of the roof buckling under their impact caused
Hmmm. You're using retort in a way that's not "to rejoin angrily", so what
does retort mean in this sentence of yours?
Retort = "loud sound". It can also mean to rejoin angrily.
"Huh?" the girl in the oversized (but wet!) shirt glanced at him.
The Sentient Narrative Prose is a perv, apparently.
No, Kusanagi is, since this is from his perspective, much like Ran makes
asides to a fictional audience in her own perspective.
Much like they, y'know, actually do. I mean, I know I covered this before,
but just in case you didn't catch that when we shifted to Kusanagi's
perspective is ALSO when all (and the only) "sentient narrative prose" aside
to how sexy women are started occuring. Also, when the SI started being
referred to as a "worm".
Giving you the benefit of the doubt, perhaps some horrible thing the FFML
did stripped out the scene breaks in this chapter, making it more difficult
to tell when the scene, and thus the perspective, has changed.
Everyone stood still for a moment. The only sound was the horrible
crunching of the aragami eating the front half of the ship.
"Uh... what are you talking about-"
"Right, girls?" the worm shouted as he seemed to teleport to the smiling
girl's side and elbow her in the ribs. "That's Chris, the evil monster
that
has
tormented us for days and unleashed this mutated horror upon the earth!"
-_- The SI wins again. He's sooooo smart. Of course he'd have the ability
to bluff as well as defy physics. While we're at it, let's
Fun fact: this was written in realtime, with my responding to whatever Aaron
threw at me. So... uh... thanks for the compliment!
Chris almost felt like dancing as he rushed away from the impending
Clash Of The Gullible Morons,
One thing I'd _loooove_ to see in an SI is to see the SI as the gullible
moron for a change... because, really, if an SI can
Sure, but it would have to be an SI written by a gullible moron, wouldn't
it?
convince himself that he can make a fic work by being so obnoxiously and
unrepentantly egotistical while dumbing down normally smart enemies so that
he could look good (Ranma can easily pick up on his father's bluffs and
usually makes bluffs on his own, so it'd really
Ranma has fallen for similar bluffs multiple times, including ones his
father has used. Given this, your ignorance of Pink and Link, and several
other references, I'm taking a guess that you're not really very familiar
with the Ranma 1/2 manga. So I shall inform you: it is based strictly on
the manga, only on the manga, not the anime. At all.
be a stretch to the imagination to see Ranma fall for a bluff in the onset
of a battle), then he's the gullible moron that's blinded by his ego.
Ranma has fallen for bluffs in the "onset" of a battle multiple times.
Would you like me to start reference volumes, chapters, and pages?
but he was still practicing Sentarou's 'glide
around on the tips of his toes while sitting in proper Martial Arts Tea
Ceremony
position' technique, so he stayed seated.
....Or at the very least the SI should make a mistake doing that thing he
does, since he's only 'practicing' Martial Arts Tea
No, actually, I'm using Sentarou's collected skill. He is a master of
Martial Arts Tea Ceremony, and thus so am I. It is merely a matter of
getting used to using the skill I already possess.
Ceremony. No human could possibly learn a technique on the first try
without prior training. I doubt this SI has little more than geeky
Fortuitously, Chris in Hybrid Theory isn't human.
Also, plenty of "humans" learn techniques on the first try: Ranma does it
all the time.
knowledge of martial arts and the various Ranma 1/2 incarnations to back up
his so called skills.
Not quite... as, of course, you would know if you'd read the previous
chapters. By the by, this was also referred to specifically in the "what
has come before" Ran narrative before the fic started.
"Hey, I thought I was asking the questions! And watch out, it's trying
to eat you again." They both casually dodged another tentacle strike.
So the tentacle monster/plant thingy serves nothing more than a
conversation piece for the SI and his created character. Goody.
Pretty much; it's a backdrop for more important things to happen. A battle
between multiple martial arts death machines and supernatural beings and a
single mindless monster who was defeated by normal humans in its original
series, even given that Pink and Link did more harm than good, would be
rather like describing, in intricate detail, your 20th level D&D group
versus one dragon. A young, mentally impaired white dragon.
Or, to use your frequent wrestling terminology, it would be like watching an
Iron Man match between JBL and Shannon Moore, and Shannon Moore has had a
prefrontal lobotomy.
...a huge spotlight shone from above, glaring in his eyes. His dead
eyes didn't need to squint, but as he looked over at it, he could only see
the
silhouettes of helicopters.
As opposed to having human eyes that are made to squint, which would force
him to do something really stupid, like land smack dab into the spiky,
acidic center of the monster. But of course, the SI should be presented as
infallible and not laughable.
No, the SI should be presented as what he is: a corpse. To have me have to
squint due to bright light would be what is known, in the business, as a
"continuity error".
If you're really desperate to see Chris humilate himself, read some of the
other chapters. Just because I happened to more or less escape this
situation with what I wanted (that being the mitama; not "good relations
with Ran", or "not having had to fight with the TAC", or "something simple
and quick", or even "not confront Ranma, who's been gunning for me for like
six chapters") hardly means I always win.
Though I do win more than the hero, being as I am a villain, and all.
Before the acid had a chance to eat more than eat through the soles of his
"eat more than eat through" sounds awkward. Suggest revising. Must be the
multiple times you've used 'eat'.
Yup, that was a typo. Thanks; I'll probably go fix that for the webpage
copy.
socks
he was away again, threading a ribbon through his hands.
Heaven be damned before an SI gets injured in his own fic.
Your SI reads like the superheroes of old... the superheroes of Saturday
Morning Cartoons that never, ever have to deal with the danger of dying.
(laugh helplessly)
to use for your fic. I mean, readers would easily lose interest to see
monsters used as fodder or characters dumbed down enough for the
Readers generally lose interest when they see "mindless monsters". Random
encounters might be interesting in RPG, but not in narratives.
I mean, though Takahashi inexplicably favors Akane above all the
There's nothing inexplicable about it. This continues to highly suggest to
me that you don't know Ranma very well, however, or are mostly familiar with
the anime.
other fiancees despite the way she wrote her character, she at least
peppers conflict in such a way that the reader doesn't immediately conclude
that Akane really going to end up with Ranma and that Akane has everything
go too easily for her. Akane's frustration with Ranma shows that that
couldn't be farther from the truth.
Takahashi has her red herrings in the form of Ukyo and Shampoo. Akane's
personality clashes with Ranma's most of the time. Ranma honestly tries his
very best to be as vague as possible about who he loves. Reader interest is
piqued and maintained among readers.
Um, no. Wrong. Wrong, wrong, wrong.
There is never the slightest iota of doubt that Akane is going to end up
with Ranma. Ever.
There is never the slightest vagueness over who Ranma loves. Ever.
If you think otherwise... then I'll be polite, and say merely that I believe
you are wrong, and see no need to clutter up the FFML with a debate about
Ranma 1/2. If you want to email me (kumonryuu@hotmail.com), I will be happy
to explain it to you in excruciatingly exhaustive and annotated detail,
containing frequent references to exact panels and dialogues. Ask anyone
who's been around the fanfic/newsgroup scene long enough, and they'll tell
you I can and will do this.
Debates about who the best fiancee for Ranma are made. All of this is
possible because Takahashi doesn't let her 'bias' for Akane affect her
writing in any way. So why don't you dare to be different with your SI.
Make him do stupid things. Have him see that working
He does plenty of stupid things. I am not a perfect person. He just
doesn't do stupid things I wouldn't do. And he just doesn't happen to do
anything that causes him to lose and perish in this particular scene.
By the by, manipulating people who are easily manipulable does not
particularly make me a master manipulator. And Ranma is easily manipulable,
whether you wish to believe it or not. (Ryouga even more so, of course.)
Have him fall in love with a character without the character reciprocating
his feelings (instead of the other way
(laughs helplessly again)
Also around then, the aragami reminded everybody of its projectile
weapon capacity by blowing the helicopter out of the sky with one of its
spines.
So here and now it shows that SI Chris > Helicopter in terms of dodging
power. Hmmm.
Well, yes, a single human-sized martial artist who can move faster than the
speed of sound is more manouvreable than a Japanese military helicopter.
I can also dodge bullets. Or catch them. Or eat them. Or let them bounce
off me. By the by, so can Ranma.
Chris mentally retracted his earlier comment about how everything was
working out perfectly. Or even well. Or even 'not half-bad'. He looked
around
for Ran. She wasn't hard to spot, given the large flashes of light
emanating
>from her position. He leaped beside her. "Okay, I need a favour."
"Y'see, I'm actually the 'writer/creator' of this world, and I've
Psst, that's Aaron.
written myself into a dead end. The monster-of-the-week appears to be far
more powerful than I had anticipated and, though I'll
Psst, no it wasn't. Pink and Link did that.
probably not die since I created this world, I have no idea how to
Psst, no I didn't: see above.
fix this little problem I've written myself into. Do you get it?"
That part's right. By screwing up the events that were supposed to happen,
Matsudaira fell out of the helicopter into the ocean and is now drowning,
rather than being rescued by Kusanagi, who is fighting Ranma due to my
"masterful manipulation".
Because I'd sink like a stone, he thought sardonically.
Ooooh, so the SI has his Kryptonite. Funny how it doesn't affect him
Not really. It's not like I can drown, though it would certainly
inconvienence me in this scene. I do have several Kryptonites, but you
don't know them, for reasons I don't think I need to keep harping on.
all that much, to the point that he immediately had a plan in his head as
soon as the shit hit the fan. Nothing fazes him, eh? So much for the token
weakness.
Once again: written in real-time, or as close as one can get while typing.
I DID have a plan. It's not like it's a complex or incredibly elaborate
one. I'm sorry I didn't pretend to be stupid for you.
Out loud, he
composed his voice and said patiently, "Because there's you, me, and two
non-
combatants here. Someone has to swim a little ways to save someone, and
someone
has to fight the giant monster. Do we have to rock-paper-scissors for
this,
or
do you have a preference?"
Preference for what? In any case, I don't think 'preference' is the word
you meant to use here.
Uh, yes it was.
I told Ran that somebody had to fight the giant monster, and somebody had to
save the drowning woman. Then I asked her what her preference was.
That was
when Chris grabbed Ran by her vest and hurled her out in the general
direction
of Matsudaira.
"HEY YOu jerrrrrrkkkk..."
Chris incidentally was in a Pokemon fic, so like Megaman after defeating an
opponent, Chris had acquired Pikachu's powers.
Um, no, I grabbed a teenage girl and flung her off the side of the boat into
the harbour, significantly far away from the ship. I can do that. So could
Ranma. So could Ran. So could Akane, for that matter.
day. And obviously Ranma wouldn't find a way to get through the monster I
create--er, saw was very Cthulu-like, because he's very much a moron! He's
so stupid when it comes to creating special
Perhaps it is possible Ranma would have come up with the same plan. It's
not like he got a chance to try.
It's not like we found out whether my plan worked either.
You'd think the girl
would have been able to stay conscious after such a short throw, but she
had
been sinking almost as fast as the old broad.
Chris: Again, ignore the fact that I waked up almost instantaneously
Not only is there is no indication I was stunned or knocked unconscious, it
is literally impossible for me to be knocked unconscious. Once more: Chris
is dead. He is a zombie. This gives a few innate advantages.
after you slugged me while you sunk like a rock at sea and went out like a
light even though you don't usually do stuff like that after
Um,. how would you know precisely what Ran does, given that you have no idea
who Ran IS?
being thrown a short distance. Never mind the fact that you've traveled to
China through the sea by swimming, or you're as tough as
Oh, you just didn't pay attention. Pay attention this time: Ran fell
unconscious and was sinking. Ranma didn't. Ranma was rescuing her.
currently in hiatus for some reason. Your fic, if you intend to
Aaron: I believe his fanfic is in hiatus because he currently has a family.
follow in the footsteps of Carrot, decisively lacks all of the great
Aaron: We don't. Quite the contrary, in fact.
things that make up a fic of his. First of all he has long outgrown the
"intrusive sentient narrative prose that does stand up comedy from time to
time" thing. Secondly, his plot ideas are genuinely
Aaron: No, he hasn't. Carrot Glace is writing in the exact same style as he
did years ago. His ability to write prose has improve slightly, his ability
to plot has improved slightly. However, he still has what you would define
as the "intrusive sentience narrative" in his work, since he frequently has
asides from the characters in his third-person limited narrative make asides
that are meant to be taken humorously. Or not humorously.
unique and hilarious. His type of comedy makes fun of the genre
Aaron: No, they are not. His plot ideas have been cribbed from Raiders of
Lost Ark, Full Metal Jacket, and every other movie he sees. Indeed, his
writing is generally "take the plot of popular movie 'a', such as Men In
Black, that I just watched", "insert my self-insert character into the role
of the main character and insert other characters into secondary roles",
then "watch the fun fly".
He does occasionally come up with entertaining and unique stories. They are
never his self-inserts. "Rain", for example.
This also does not mean I do not like his self-inserts. I find them funny,
the same way I might find a Mad Magazine movie parody funny. I would not
refer to either as "unique".
itself more, as opposed to your fic which is struggling to make fun
For about the umpteenth time, no it isn't. The fact you jumped to that
conclusion is entirely your own conceit.
"I know... but... but that camera was everything to me..." Ran crossed
her arms over her chest and hunched her shoulders. "It cost me... I can't
possibly replace it. Especially since without my shots, I don't even have
a
story and..."
Ran: Oh yeah, as a camera owner I should know first and foremost that a
camera that's wet with salt water is as good as a pet rock when you need to
take pictures with it! And I won't even go there with dirty salt water and
film... I should have been bawling the minute I realized that my camera's
in Tokyo Bay, along with all the other hooligans that yakuza are wont to
throw into the water!
Psst: the problem with her camera isn't so much that it's wet, but that it's
at the bottom of Tokyo Bay somewhere, which is a body of water which is very
large and deep, and they have no idea where it is aside from "somewhere in a
large radius around the sinking boat".
Oh, and it's night, too.
Ranma: Ssshhh! This is another one of the author's plot points! Don't ruin
it! I'm supposed to be sweet and kind and caring and then you'll realize
it!
Psst: Ranma does this sort of stuff all the time.
Shampoo was impatient. She was standing in the living room of this
'Tendo Dojo' great-grandmother had brought her to. The nice girl with the
brown
hair had served tea, and was now sitting at the table looking pleasant
and...
well, that was about it, really.
One dimensional characterization of Kasumi, check...
Exactly what would you have us have Kasumi do during this scene? Perhaps
she should be engaging in KUNG-FU KOMBAT with Shampoo? That'd be
in-character, right? Because god knows there's never any scenes in the
series where Kasumi serves refreshments then sits in the background looking
pleasant.
The other girl, with the shorter brown
hair,
was staring at her oddly, and flipping through some sort of scrapbook.
Shampoo
was preferring to ignore that.
Suggest: Shampoo preferred to ignore that.
Yup, I agree with that change.
I'll give you props on Shampoo's POV take on Japanese. Barring all the
other things I've already mentioned about half-hearted attempts at humor,
convoluted plot points, character bashing and a self insert in all its
'glory', this is quite a good insight into the mind of Shampoo. Kudos.
Thanks. I like writing Shampoo.
The brown-haired nice woman started talking. She heard 'Ranma'
mentioned at least once, but couldn't really make out most of the rest.
Something about her being somewhere... "Great-grandmother," she said,
reverting
to her native tongue. "What did that girl say? Where's Ranma?"
Eyng? So this time Shampoo really hasn't learned all that much Japanese?
Because, ironically enough, the Shampoo in the anime had
She hadn't in the series, either, at this point.
horrible knowledge of Chinese outside of 'Nihao' and 'Airen'. But of
This is also true, but I ignore it, for the same reason I ignore the fact
that characters fluent in English invariably never actually are.
course, I'd be digressing and breaking the proverbial fourth wall this
time. :P
"Who's that? Do they have something to do with Ranma?"
"That is what I'm attempting to discover. Really, child, you should
have been taking the time along our trip to practice your Japanese. That
is
why
I gave you the Stone of Acclimation, after all."
It's a stone that makes fish/wood moisture content to become used to a
given environment?
ac�cli�ma�tion ( P ) Pronunciation Key (kl-mshn)
n.
1. The process of acclimating or of becoming acclimated.
2. Acclimatization.
Seems to me that your Shampoo's really laying it thick on the
caveman/Tarzan speak, despite her aforementioned hatred for the 'primitive'
Japanese language.
Exact quote of Shampoo's actual first lines:
Shampoo: Ranma... KILL!!
(Ranma runs away)
Shampoo: Ranma!
Akane: He's gone.
Shampoo: BAD!
She does not have even her later degree of fluency until later on.
"I will NOT be calm!" she roared. "Great-grandmother, you are my
revered elder, but this is going too far! You cannot interfere in my quest
of
honour! Remove yourself from the field of battle at once!"
As much as I like drama and the way you've handled this scene, this Shampoo
is acting strangely (and this is a cliche saying of mine
Of course Shampoo is acting strangely. Stuff from previous chapters that
you do not know about has caused her to a) be very, very angry, and b) be
very, very angry at Cologne specifically.
She isn't OOC.
Although...
when it comes to C&Cing most fics) OOC. Shampoo is usually not disobedient
of her grandmother's wishes. Hell, the one time she had to disobey, her
granny sent her to Jusenkyo as punishment. Bottom line, though... an IC
Shampoo would instead look at her granny in
Shampoo is disrespectful to Cologne several times in the series, when she
feels like it. She in fact did physical harm to her at one point (not
counting Phoenix Mountain).
confusion and askance instead of outright indignation. Her line of "Remove
yourself from the field of battle at once" makes me wince... the statement
reminds me of Kuno, y'see.
She's being formal, since she's talking about formal things.
The old woman ignored her!
I have seen at least four fics that makes use of the exclamation point to
surprise the reader with a revelation! So far it has never worked!
Good think it wasn't supposed to surprise you, and was in fact yet another
manifestation of the fact this is third-person limited and not third-person
omniscient!
Exclamation marks are used for emphasis!
She smashed her fist through a wall, which
was
made of sturdier building material. That felt better. But only slightly.
(shrug) I've already pointed out the most obvious problem Shampoo has in
terms of characterization. If Shampoo fans are in any way like Akane fans,
then they'll be voicing out their complaints in a manner approximating to
this:
By the by, remember that scene I quote above, showing how you were wrong
about Shampoo's Japanese fluency? I forgot to add some description:
(Shampoo smashes a giant hole through a wall.)
Shampoo: Ranma... KILL!!
(Shampoo vicious attacks Ranma , who runs away after a bit of combat.)
Shampoo: Ranma!
Akane: He's gone.
(Shampoo snarls in rage and whips her bonbori, randomly destroying a set of
nearby lockers.)
Shampoo: BAD!
So, if a hypothetical Shampoo fan were to complain that she was OOC in that
scene, they would be, in fact, wrong. She was angry enough to do stuff like
this in the actual series.
into. Bottom line? Though the drama is palpable, Shampoo being this angry
isn't kosher or logical given her personality and the circumstances.
Yes, well, I think the anime did it differently, and I'm guessing that's
where you draw most of your info.
This reads all new to me... must be because of the fact that this is the
most OOC I've ever seen Shampoo portrayed. Not necessarily a
Actually, that's a sad commentary on how inaccurate, cliched and
one-dimensional virtually every fanfic portrayal of Shampoo is (oh yes,
they're not all alike, but they're all pretty much wrong). Having Shampoo
show up at the Tendo Dojo and act like she did when she first showed up in
the Ranma 1/2 series has you reeling with her "OOCness".
"You... I... love." Then she turned to the side and spat.
So lemme get this straight... Shampoo's Fic-Akane-angry in this story,
Ukyo's driven to psychotic madness because of some dumb-ol'
Ukyou has problems relating to dumb-ol' self insert, yes. I mean, you'd
probably have problems too, sharing your skull with someone. Though, in
actuality, Ukyou really brought most of her problems upon herself.
self insert (I'm guessing), I'm dreading what you've done to Akane
Akane is Akane. She is IC.
and Kodachi will always be Kodachi. Right. At this rate, Ranma'll
I killed Kodachi, took her body, had it rot out from underneath me, then
discarded it. I'm not sure that counts.
never get married! All because of the Psychotic Fiancees of Fan Fiction
Hell!!!!1
Fun fact: Ranma is not romantically involved with a single one of those
women in Hybrid Theory.
So the immediate question that comes to my mind is... Is your plot in any
way possible? The lobotomy of Shampoo aside, is it even believable. W-ell,
the way Ranma defeated Shampoo twice in the manga give credibility to why
Shampoo's so smitten with Ranma. "So why Shampoo be like this to Girly Man
now?" I guess that, given the circumstances that somehow Ranma wasn't able
to show his manly qualities to Shampoo and instead a seething hatred
developed in the Amazon girl, then I guess it's kinda sorta believable. So
what made Shampoo snap like that? I do hope the answer's not a shrug, a
sigh, and a "because I felt like Shampoo should snap" explanation, because
this goes beyond character bashing or character development, and I'm not
exactly 'raring to go' to find out which is which by reading the past
chapters. I'm not masochistic, after all.
Well, you know what? Tough shit. I could give a scene-by-scene summary of
everything that's happened in the last 9 chapters to lead every character
smoothly up until this point, but... uh... why precisely should I? Aside
from the fact that'd be the length of a chapter or two in and of itself,
it's not like you even so much as asked politely.
With all these plot points left and right and several other crossovers in
the background, why exactly do you need this to be an SI fic when it's the
SI who actually ruins any chance that this fic might get read by many other
readers?
Because the entire concept of the fic requires it to be an SI.
In fact, the first thing we got to when writing a deconstruction of SIs is
"SIs never actually require an SI to tell a story". Hybrid Theory does.
But, then, that's an extension of the fact that no character, plotline,
object, or crossover element in Hybrid Theory that is not necessary to the
plot.
There's other reasons, too.
Nabiki clutched her gut and shook her head. No, this would never
work
unless she kept a straight face. Her father was a gullible idiot,
Author: Spread the love? Bah! Spread the character bashing! Everybody in
Ranma 1/2 sucks except me--er, the ever-lovin' self inserts of this fic!
Soun IS a gullible idiot. And Nabiki blatently thinks he is, too.
The
problem was that Shampoo so obviously hated Ranma, it was hard to take
their
pairing seriously.
Rabid Ukyo Fan: Take away the instance of Shampoo and replace it with
'Akane' and you'll have an idea of what we think of the so-called 'true
fiancee'.
Yes, but such a fan is a blithering idiot.
Nabiki smirked.
Boy, those cliche manipulative bad girls do smirk a lot.
Would you like a list of page/panel references on exactly how often Nabiki
smirks whenever she plots anything?
Well, you won't get them, because I do not have unlimited spare time to
compile trivia for you. But trust me: she smirks a lot.
At least she had advance notice of what all the
commotion had been about. She had read the data on Shampoo. In time,
Shampoo
would fall madly in love with Ranma. Although why Ukyou had bothered to
list
Shampoo as his 'main rival' was still something that perplexed Nabiki.
Ah, so this fic plays with the "pre-revelation" times of Ranma,
Yes. Does the fact you were utterly ignorant of that up until now, but made
assumptions on various characters (notably Ranma) based on your mistaken
ideas of what the timeline was like, tell you something?
Aaron: To answer your snipped question, the fanfic is not ABOUT Nabiki
knowing the future, which is why the story does not focus on that and the
SIs are not culled from it. If you really want to read a fic about Nabiki
knowing the future, there are five or six of them out there.
So what happened to Nabiki? Some self insert tried to use her body
Stuff. In previous chapters.
thought-processes? Nabiki's been 'spoilerized' of the entire 26 volumes of
Ranma 1/2 and she wants to gleefully apply her
There are 38 volumes of Ranma 1/2.
This could actually be a great opportunity in drama if not for the dire and
grave circumstances the fic makes light of. A girl making a
When, precisely, did the fic make light of this? Even Ran mentioning it in
the prequel did not particularly make light of it; rather just noted it
happened.
mark reacted.
Professional Wrestlers: (nods sagely)
Aaron: FYI, "mark" is a term that has been around long before professional
wrestling, is used in other contexts than professional wrestling, and will
likely be around long after professional wrestling is gone.
"I will..." Ryouga nodded. "But... is that it? I..." He looked down
again. "I can't... just this can't be the end of it!"
"Isn't this better for you?" Nabiki hissed. "You've cleared your
conscience. You've offered contrition and penance. Now you can go back to
being
a monster in peace. You never have to fear me revealing to anyone what you
did."
Y'know, this trick will only really work on Ryoga, Nabiki.
So, it's a good thing that's who she's using it on, right?
(Actually, it would work on several other characters, too. But Ryouga is
who Nabiki had access to.)
Now obviously I haven't bothered to read your fic from the very start. Let
me remedy that and take li'l sneak peek at the
Oh really? I hadn't noticed. ;p
I'll just snip most of the rest, since it a) is stuff you've said about six
times before, and b) might apply to Hybrid Theory, or might not, but you
have no way of knowing and are leaping to wild assumptions again.
Ranma: So Mr. "Self Insert" (squeezes his first two fingers together to
indicate the quotations), I have a question. If you really, y'know, know
everything there is to know aboutmy entire life in this town... all the
problems, the good bits and
the bad bits that always interrupted the good bits, all the fears and
concerns... then tell me, for the sake of argument, that I, in a very
supposed, never-could-happen-but-wonder-if situation of wanted to marry
Akane, how would I make it happen?
Chris: Not really a factor, since you don't love Akane in this version of
events.
Ranma: Pretend I do! It's for an example!
Chris: I don't give a shit about solving your problems, Ranma. I have my
own problems. You, in fact, are one of them. Why should I help you out?
Ranma: It's....An...Example. Pretend you're my friend and we're in Ranma
1/2 continuity and you care!
Chris: Well, in that case, there's several dozen ways for you to shuck off
your entanglements and get married to Akane in relatively short order. Not
that it matters, because you won't do them, since a) you enjoy having
multiple women fawning over you, b) you're too arrogant to take advice from
me, especially advice that presumes I am more intelligent than you, and c)
you actually want to avoid hurting people's feelings in some situations,
even though you often hurt people's feelings in others.
Ranma: Screw you and your logic!
Ukyou: I know how to solve your problems, Ranma! Actually, I was trying to
do that in the previous nine chapters, but it all horribly blew up in my
face!
Chris: Funny, that.
It's like asking people what their stance is on mercy killing or women
asking men if they're getting fat. There's no right answer. So
For the first, there most certainly is a right answer. Also for the second:
"no".
I certainly do believe that an SI won't truly be able to get his jollies by
knowing absolutely everything a geek can know about Ranma. In fact, this is
usually why most SIs would rather use superpowers to solve Ranma's problems
without him even asking them to do so. BUT it's still not a justification
to make use of superpowers. Oh, and it's also not a justification for mind
control/short-term lobotomies to suit the needs of the SI. I mean, why not
try and take a stab at solving Ranma's fiancee problems realistically
without powers, mind-control, lobotomies and whatnot?
Chris: Because it's IMPOSSIBLE!
It's incredibly possible, but I don't give a shit about Ranma's problems in
Hybrid Theory. Also, Ranma doesn't HAVE fiancee problems such as they exist
in the Ranma 1/2 manga, courtesy of Ukyou.
Seriously though, I've told you everything there is to be told about your
fic.
One thing to be said for you, sir: you are certainly NOT a person with a
lack of self-esteem.
The chapter _was_ a bit long (or did it only seem long... hmmmm...), so I
suggest spacing your chapters out a bit. Instead of having a chapter 10,
why not redistribute your fic into 30 or so bite-sized chapters that's
easier to read through from the first page to the last? Your readers will
thank you, and your loyal, "I like this fic as is" readers will adore you.
Or maybe not. In any case, they will be generally grateful.
The chapters are as long as they need to be to cover the plot arc that
occurs in them. They're also released on a monthly schedule, meaning that
pretty much anybody can work their way through it.
Plus, frankly, I personally much prefer 30 100-200K chapter than 150 30-50K
ones. Seeing "Chapter 126" of a fanfic turns me off.
But let's face it, the problem of this fic isn't really found in those
things, right? It's staring us right in the face, so there's no need to
ignore the problem. It's not going anywhere anytime soon.
You're right, it isn't, though not for the reasons you think.
Obviously, the problem is with the SI. Generally, SI fics suck in both the
storytelling department and by design. But I can see that you're a decent
storytelller that's getting bogged by the SI himself. My most basic
suggestion is to get rid of the SI format and just write a goddamn story.
You're against getting rid of the SI? Good for you, but might I suggest a
few minor things to revise before you altogether simplify my critique as a
fanfic bash? All the
To be absolutely fair, if you didn't want me to regard this as a fanfic
bash, you might have tried to avoid long, vituperative diatribes about how
much it sucked. And continuously in these diatribes harped on the fact it
was an SI, often with no real justification other than "an SI is bad by
definition" (and the rest of the time, talking about problems that don't
actually exist).
Aaron: This gave us the impression that you mostly believe the fanfic is bad
is because you believe SIs are bad, and therefore your train of logic is:
SI = Bad.
This Fic = SI
Therefore
This Fic = Bad.
If we do not accept your first premise, which obviously we do not, then your
argument carries no weight. The fact that most SIs are bad is not the fault
of them being SIs, but rather that the fanfics themselves are bad.
you want. It's okay. I don't care. What I'm doing here, as far as I'm
concerned, is a critique. An honest and brutally frank critique, but a
critique nonetheless. Oh, look at the time... It's standard disclaimer
time.
I appreciate the work, again, but like I said, it is simply impossible to
really take your conclusions seriously when your conclusions are incredibly
imperfect evidence. Some of your grammar corrections would be good.
It's too bad you hadn't been reading the fic from the beginning, or that you
didn't choose to read the fic from the beginning (at our website, where it
is archived, which was linked to in the post you responded to), because then
we would be far more likely to have a reason to apply your advice, or at
least consider it seriously. As is, as you did not say a single thing I
didn't irritably list five or six counterexamples for while reading your
review, which you are completely ignorant of... how can I possibly be
expected to assume your assessment is accurate?
Perhaps you would think the same way if you had read the entire story to
date. Perhaps you would not. We'll never know. Oh well.
I'd like to clarify once again that this isn't a simple "bash the fic"
thing I'm doing here. This is a critique. Please don't go mentally
simplifying my comments (incorrectly) as "He just didn't like my fic so
anything he says can't be taken seriously." It's your
We didn't!
We just said "He just didn't read our fic (or the Ranma 1/2 manga), so
anything he says can't be taken seriously".
I'm sorry. But it's true nonetheless.
jurisdiction to ignore the comments, yes, and to take them with a grain of
salt, yes, but please do at least consider that this isn't just bias
talking when I say, "Okay, so I hate the SI and it's silly for me to ask
you to get rid of the SI since this is basically an SI fic, so at the very
least make use of these comments of mine to make your SI less... of a
problem," or "Maybe it's too late to tell you that your portrayal of the SI
is the greatest obstacle this fic faces in getting a decent readership, but
hot damn it's not too late for the fic to make amends... Bash that bastard,
Chris! Bash him in like a wayward tent pole!" Okay, so bias was definitely
talking in the latter sentence, but I hope you do get my drift. The SI can
still be salvaged.... by a re-write, perhaps. Don't want a re-write? Then
please do keep my comments in mind in future installments. You think
nothing is wrong with your fic and I'm only here to bash your poor SI?
Whatever, dude. It's your fic and your jurisdiction.
In any case, ignore my vinegar-laced comments if you'd like. I'm only
"keeping it real" and telling you straight out what I found wrong in the
fic. If you want to keep your fic as is, good. If you
Well, I tried hard to be quite civil in my response, though I will tell you
flatly that you pissed me off with several of the comments you made.
Luckily, there was a good 12 hour gap between reading and responding.
found my comments helpful in some level, even better. The best advice I
could give you that you needn't take with a grain of salt is to keep on
writing... It's the best solution to character bashing, a godly and
irritating Self Insert or two, an ungodly amount of discretions and author
asides, a dumbed-down Ranma whenever the SI is around, and the stand up
comedy narration that belongs in a snore-fest Saturday Night Live skit:
actual experience of what a better story constitutes. I would also suggest
to read more fics, or to just read more books; it really helps. That's my
two cents. Abdiel out.
We... read a lot.
Boy, this was long.
Well, thank you for the thought, even if much of it really can't be used by
us. But I'm glad you thought, anyway. Thought is never so bad. The moment
people stop thinking is when the terrorists have won, and all that jazz.
I need sleep now. Goodnight.
Blade
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