This will be the final post on this subject, since this thread is now
banned just like the thread that generated it. I'm making this a public
post in order to avoid leaving accusations floating in the air, and I
apologize for the use of everyone's mailbox space.
On Wed, 3 Nov 1999, Rebeka Thomas wrote:
as for my new tag [Opressive Adm_n,] this will be used in all responses to
Harnum's admin posts until he manages to DROP this grudge he claims not to
have against me. And i'm within my rights here, this is not a flame.
Alan Harnum has no grudge against you. Rather, you repeatedly flout the
rules of the FFML and fail to understand why this is a bad thing. This is
why you have repeatedly fallen under disciplinary action by the FFML
staff.
Let us begin with a quotation from the FAQ:
* 4) If you are not an FFML administrator, DO NOT use the [Admin] tag. You
* should generally not reply on-list to [Admin] posts; if for some reason
* you feel it is absolutely necessary to do so, remove the tag [Admin]
* from the subject header. Anyone using the [Admin] tag who is not an
* admin will be tempbanned.
Which part of 'you should generally not reply on-list to [Admin] posts
did you not understand, Ms. Thomas? If you have a complaint against the
admins, that is what the ffml-admins@fanfic.com address is for, rather
than the FFML itself.
Technically, you neglected to remove the [Admin] tag from your post;
making a symbolic gesture of changing one letter doesn't remove your
intent. I could tempban you for that, but I won't, since no one is going
to mistake your post for one by an administrator in this case.
You also said:
* However, explanations of just WHY you are holding a grudge against me
* are welcome and expected.
And Our Friend the FAQ said under the Category of 'Don't Beat a Dead
Horse':
* - Personal arguments between yourself and another list member. If
* you have a problem with someone else's behavior, take it up with
* him/her by private mail. If you feel someone is violating
* list policy, E-mail the admins about it. Posting to the list is
* not a good idea, as this sort of thing tends to result in long
* and bitter spam feuds.
You also decided to take what you regard as a personal feud onto the list,
which is clearly forbidden as you see above.
While to say you're my favourite person to deal with on the list would be
untrue, I have no deep grudge against you. As long as you obey the rules
of the list (laid out in the short and eminently readable FFML FAQ),
you're
free to do what you want.
Bull.
I will elaborate further if requested.
hell with it, i'll elaborate now, though i was hoping to make an impact with
a one-word response. You banned me, though i was not complained about, for
posting a reply to a private email. this [doing it without a complaint] was
unprecedented and unwarranted.
It doesn't require a complaint. to quote the FAQ:
* - It goes without saying that a private message should be replied
* to privately. Do not reply to private messages on the list,
* unless the sender gives you permission to do so.
Complaint is not mentioned in the FAQ. It simply says to not do it
without permission, which you did not have at the time.
Okay... wait for the spam-flood, THEN ban it. THAT's the only way you can
use that precent to justify yourself. you didn't mention any precedents for
preemptively banning challenges that -might- have a flood of responses.
First, let us quote your original post:
* I hereby challenge this mailing list to run campaigns for Anime
* characters. you have exactly one year, i am shopping for a free voting
* cgi script, which will be open from midnight to midnight on November
* 3rd, 2000. [dont say that that's slightly less than a year, because
* you're getting an extra day on 29Feb.]
* The voting page will be open to the entire internet, and advertised via
* icq starting one week beforehand. you are permitted to run your campaign
* anywhere you want to, but make sure that you run it primarily on the
* FFML or your character will probably not appear on the ballot.
And in your first reply (in violation of list policy by replying on-list
to an admin post)
* What I had in mind was that each campaigner would post a well-thought
* out advertisement, about fanfic length, and involving several other
* characters. Then the most major two candidates for the largest positions
* would be put in a debate situation, and I would send the debate out to
* the ML, and have it on my voting site as well. The debate, as well as
* summaries of each character's stand on the issues and their political
* platform would be posted, along with selected ads, in stages starting
* anywhere from 3 days to a week before election day. Polls would open on
* midnight the night of November 2nd [morning of Nov-3rd] and would be
* announced two hours beforehand [you do allow WWW announcements i think.
* if not, just tell me]
Now, let us quote the FAQ:
* * WHAT CAN I POST TO THE ML?
* You can post stories, of course; C&C on posted stories is also very
* welcome, and posting well-thought out story ideas is permissible. Also,
* where to find background and character information and questions and
* answers about the same. Email people directly when answering a simple
* question, and don't forget to remind people to email you directly when
* answering your question. Posting requests for fics to the list is
* strongly discouraged; see "How can I find a fanfic that I'm looking
* for?" below.
What you propose to do is to flood the FFML with off-topic election spam
for the period of a year. This is neither a story, nor a story idea, nor
a request for background or character information. Instead, you ask
people to repeatedly post off-topic messages for the period of a year.
This could potentially dwarf any flood of spam we've had in the past.
Now, if Alan had tempbanned you simply for posting this, I could
understand you feeling it was unjust, but Alan simply banned this thread.
There is nothing to stop you from organzing your campaign off the list,
and your original request has gone through. There is nothing to stop you
posting any submissions on a website where people could read them. But
the FFML is not an appropriate format for conducting such a campaign.
The purpose of the FFML is to enable people to read and comment on stories
and to ask for information to help them write stories, not to engage in
spammy contests or conduct surveys or to otherwise raise the Spam/Content
ratio. This is not a challenge to write stories, and it was not phrased
as such in your original post, but rather to engage in off-topic character
debate and to flood the list with spam political debates. This is not a
forum for 'political platforms' and 'stands on the issues'.
Simply put, your post was off-topic, and on-list responses to it would be
off-topic, and thus, we banned the thread right off the bat in order to
avoid a years' worth of spam. The FAQ does not state the Admins will wait
until after everyone is deluged with spam. It is our job to reduce spam,
which includes heading it off at the pass. Given that you explicitly
asked for on-list responses, we felt it to be our responsibility to deal
with this.
Having said this to make the position of the Admins on this clear, I am
banning further on-list discussion of this, as Admin posts are not
supposed to generate threads which are themselves off the topic of the
FFML. Debate is closed, and further posting in this thread on the FFML
will result in disciplinary measures.
John Biles
FFML Moderation Team (Not dead yet)