On Sun, 16 Feb 1997, Ki'var wrote:

"B> I suppose this means that it's 'jumping through too many hoops' to go to,
"B> say, ftp.std.com to the anime fanfiction archive to pick up older fiction,
"B> instead of asking 'does anyone know where I can get a copy of
"B> <such-and-so>?'.
"B>

No, because using the remailer to obtain a file isn't the same as ftping
a file directly from ftp.std.com or any other ftp site. And if you think it
is, it shows just how little you know about using ftp to obtain a file.

Bear with me here:

How to obtain a file from FTP:

1) contact server (use ftp client)
2) locate desired file (cd, ls/dir)
3) give command to server requesting desired file.

How to obtain a file from the fanfic remailer:

1) Contact server (use mail client)
2) Locate desied file (request recent posts summary list)
3) give command to server requesting desired file.

Funny that... THEY'RE FAIRLY SIMILAR!

And yes, before you ask, I do in fact know how FTP works.  Given that I've
written an FTP client in the past, I probably know how it works BETTER
THAN YOU.  

The point is that almost all file retrieval systems... smartlist post
retrieval, majordomo archive retrieval, ftp clients, fsp clients, and even
web servers all work on the same basic priciple, with different command
implementations.  YOu connect to the server, optionally locate the file
(yes, there is in fact in HTTP/1.1 the equivalent of a directory command
to navigate the website tree and find a file.  Works great for search
engines), and give the server a command requesting that file.  Yes, the
commands themselves are different, but the process is pretty similar.

You may argue that FTP is more widely known than a mailing list retrieval
system; this is true - that's why instructions on how to do this are
available automated from the remailer AND were in the FAQ.

If you want to continue this conversation privately, feel free.  I
consider my point made to the FFML (that the remailer is a viable option,
especially when you want everything posted since a certain date), and if
you wish to continue arguing the differences between FTP and remailing
requesters, feel free to continue in private mail.

"B> I admit that the fanfic remailer can be a pain.  But look at the sheer
"B> volume of people who asked for 'Transitions' recently.  The list could
"B> have been cut down on traffic rather impressively if people had just
"B> checked the remailer.  Or the people who posted 'could someone send me all
"B> the posts I missed since <x date>'... that's where the remailer really
"B> comes in handy.
"B>

Just who are you trying to kid? A lot of the traffic here consists of
nonsense postings from the IRC/AOL/USENET chat crowd and everyone knows
it. Personally I've always found any argument people make conserning message
traffic to be rather silly anyway. No one is forcing you to read these
messages. What I find absurd is messages that contain 24 or more
lines of "spoiler protection". These are the kinds of messages that
really eat up harddrive space ect,ect,ect....

Not everyone is so lucky, though.  Some people have mail quotas.  Yes,
there is a lot of noies other than jut this; but if you say "Well, we
shouldn't bother trying to get rid of the noise we can because there's
more of the noise we can't", that's ridiculous.  Clearing up ANY of the
spam on this list will help.  Yes, I admit this message counts as spam to
some extent, but you probably don't object to that, since 'there's more
spam from the IRC/AOL/USENET chat crowd'.

"B> But in reply to your comment to 'keep your nose out of the thread'
"B> otherwise... people requesting copies of fanfics should never HAVE to be a
"B> thread in and of themselves...that's the point.

Are you serious, or just being an jerk? What pray tell is exactly wrong
with a thread consiting of people asking where so and so can be found, or
could someone send them a copy of it ? It's a heck of a more interesting
thread/subject some of the postings saying just how wonderful some
of the gay/lemon fanfics (bleh) are for instance...

Perhaps true.  And I don't have a rpoblem with it being asked once.  But
when as many people ask for a fanfic as has happened, it's best that
possible alternatives be pointed out.  Otherwise, all of WWolf's work in
putting together the archival system is sort of pointless, now isn't it?

I'm not trying to be a jerk; I do have a friend whose mailbox overflowed
and was deleted because of all the traffic lately.  Instead of sending
them all the posts they missed, I pointed them to the fanfic remailer.
They were able to find the messages they'd missed, request them, and read
them at their leisure.  Which is what the remailer was intended for.

As I said, if you want to continue this thread, let's take it off the FFML
to avoid adding to the problem, shall we?

    +---[ Loki ]-------------+----------------------------------------+
    | Jeremy "Loki" Blackman | Founder, Maison Otaku Productions      |
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    | loki@thekeep.org       | NeonMuck Server Maintainer             |
    +------------------------+ http://www.maison-otaku.net/neon       |
    | Lunatic Coder, etc     | http://www.maison-otaku.net/~loki      |
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