On Fri, 24 Jan 1997, Ben Kosse wrote:

RL>I have to disagree with that last line.  One person's good taste is
     Would you disagree with that last line when the authors themselves said
it was sick and disgusting?

Then you would have to consider why they wrote it.  If they wrote it
purely for shock value, well, then I may not read it, but that's more
because I think it needs a point or plot beyond the shock.  But sometimes,
an author may think that something needs to be said that is still sick and
disgusting.  (Sick and disgusting things do happen in the world, and I
often find stories with relevance or a point to them to have one more
thing going for them than some pure escapist stories do.)  And sometimes,
sick and disgusting events can be used for wonderful black humor - "Within
the Candle-Flame, for instance, was gruesomely hilarious at times, and
Spoof Chase is often hilarious even as it warps and perverts the
characters to extreme degrees.

     Would you support a picture of a 10-year old girl eating the shit of a
man deficating on her face while a 12-year old boy pissed all over her?
What if it
was obviously not taken of a willing girl?
     Jeanne and Richard, is that good taste?

I'd say it would quite possibly be child abuse - circumstances might vary
depending on what exactly was involved, but I can't see them varying by
much. 

     Now, obviously if such a picture was taken and released, the photographer
thought it had some sort of artistic merit. Would you support it on those
grounds? (The picture described above is, I hope, fictional)
     Now, mind you I'm not saying that gay fanfiction is always like that.

I should hope not - but tell me, exactly which ten and twelve year old
children were abused in the making of, say, The Surrogate?  Not counting
fictional ones.

RL>what they want to.  They will anyway.  Accept it, and relax.  :)
     I do agree, but that doesn't mean I can't suggest and ask that authors
try their hand at stories done for entertainment, not to see how sick and
demented they can get. Nor, does it stop me from asking for a warning.

Sometimes being sick and demented *can* be entertainment - at least for
some people.  It's the principle that made some types of horror movies so
popular.  As for warnings - well, yes, I do think that it's good form to
include a notice as to what your fic is about - but what if someone put in
something that they thought was weird, but non-offensive, and then someone
finds it quite offensive?  Like it or not, in a diverse world/forum/list,
there *will* be culture and assumption clashes.  (This very debate is an
example of one - between those who think dark, twisted fics have a place
and those who can't stand the idea.)

     Likewise, I fully support fics like "Surrogate" which make you think
about important issues. I don't think "Surrogate" should be distributed
without a warning though. It *IS* a dark fic and has segments certain
people might be offended by. I didn't like reading "Surrogate" but it was
good. But, it's not the story you show to someone looking for typical
campy Ranma commedy.

I haven't read Surrogate yet (I think it may not have shown up in my
inbox), but I think that the fact that it wasn't a campy comedy would
probably have shown up in the first few paragraphs.  In truth, I think
*very* few fics on this list are 'typical Ranma/Sailor Moon/Aa!
Megamisama/Yuu Yuu Hashuko (did I spell that right?)/whatever.'  Some are
more serious than the original, some insert new characters or new
situations, some do major weirdness to the setting, some are parodies and
so forth.  There's comedy here, true, but most of the comedies aren't just
campy comedic fluff - even the lightest tends to have more behind it than
the typical Ranma 1/2 Nettouhen anime episode.

     Hell, I am writing Dragon Path. I don't condone that sort of world, but
I won't let someone tell me not to write it. I did put a warning out there,
and I will repost that warning with other chapters on a semi-regular basis
(especially chapter 6, as pre-readers can probably attest to).

Very good of you.  Keep on writing, by all means, and write as weird,
demented, horrific tales as you like.  And the note is a nice touch -
unlike you, I wouldn't classify it as essential, but it's very definitely
a classy, courteous gesture to potential readers.  I'd *encourage* writers
to do things like this - but I certainly wouldn't chastize them if they
didn't.  But then again, I don't tend to get shocked or revolted by all
that much.

--
Scott Johnson |
zagyg@io.com  |        This space intentionally left blank.