Subject: Re: [FFML] [Ranma][Fanfic][Revised] Hearts and Minds Prelude 5 - Tendo Akane: Something Old
From: Sean Connor
Date: 8/21/1998, 3:56 AM
To: ffml@fanfic.com, Nick Leifker

On Fri, Aug 21, 1998 at 12:58:27AM +0000, Gary Kleppe wrote:

Huh? When was this shown? As I understand it, Soun didn't do any cooking
in the canon for the simple reason that Kasumi was there to do it for
him.

This isn't canon.  It's a possible (and entirely reasonable)
explanation of the canon, but it isn't canon.

You frequently confuse the two.

Do you have ANY manga to back this change of heart up?

Do you have any that shows that Soun would have a particular *aversion*
towards learning to cook?

Let's see here...

In your fic, Soun learns how to cook.  There's no real proof that he
would do such a thing, but there's no real proof that he wouldn't,
either.  (You've both brought up reasons why it might go either way,
but neither of you have any conclusive proof of your stands.)

Now, in Sydney Kyle's fic, "Akane and Ranma", Mr. Kyle portrays Ukyou
as Ranma's best friend.  Again, there's no real proof either way.
(But again, however, there are reasons why she might be, or might not
be.)

Your response to Mr. Kyle's fic was to demand evidence for his
position -- quite loudly and rudely, I might add.

Nick's response was to ask you for evidence for your position, in
terms that were rather more polite than yours.

Why is this?  Why do you think Mr. Kyle should provide proof of his
characterization, when you obviously don't think you need to provide
proof of yours?

No problem. I welcome honest feedback in *any* area. Be as critical as
you like -- but don't expect me to necessarily agree with you. As for
Soun's cooking, I'll gladly change it if you can give me evidence,
direct or indirect, that Soun would have a problem with taking up
cooking after Kasumi left.

Even if it were proven that Soun wouldn't learn to cook, this would be
an exceedingly minor quibble.  From what I can grok of Nick's
personality from his online presence, he simply isn't petty.  I would
therefore think that this (slight, at worst) mischaracterization
wasn't the main point of him mentioning it...
 
you're going to be snobbish about characterization (as you are, all too
often), then your own has got to be airtight, otherwise you're nothing
more than a hypocrite.

No, no, no... I only CLAIM loudly and proudly to be a hypocrite... but
deep down, I'm secretly sincere. ^_^  (Figure THAT out. :-P)

I don't really have to waste time trying to untangle your verbal
Gordian knots.  As I think has been amply shown above, you expect a
much higher level of proof of other people's characterizations than
you do of your own.  Might that be something that a hypocrite would
do?  (besides talking about me and talking about you? :)

 To me, it looks like you
twisted the characters out of shape to do your will - precisely what you
accuse others of on a regular basis.

And to me, it looks like you are criticizing my characterizations only
because I criticized your characterizations. (And IIRC, I did so *once,*
not on a "regular basis.")

Read his post again.  He stated that you critisized _other people's_
characterization on a regular basis, not his in particular.  Do you
really care to dispute that charge?

And to me, it looks like you're "poisoning the well" here.
Considering how hard you've been on others about characterization, it
is only natural that people will be extremely hard on you in return.

In short, you're starting to reap what you've... er...  Soun.

But if you want to play devil's advocate on my use of the characters,
that's fine. I'm not convinced by either of your arguments at this
point, though.

Perhaps that's because you're using the standards you set for your own
fics, rather than the standards you use for other people's fics.

For fun, let's try applying the standards you've used on other
people's fics to this situation.

First of all, from your criticism of Mr. Kyle's fic, one could easily
get the impression that you think that something shouldn't be shown in
a fic unless it can be conclusively proven. (ie. Ukyou and Ranma being
"best friends".)

Soun doesn't cook or do domestic work in the manga.  That is an
objective fact.  (Much firmer than the thing about Ranma and Ukyou,
which has a strong subjective component.)  Yet your fic has him
learning how to cook.

Your reasoning is that he wouldn't be able to stand Akane's cooking.
Fair enough.  I find that to be a believable reason why he might take
up cooking.  However, it doesn't _prove_ that he would, so by your
definition, it is OOC.

Same deal with Shampoo.  You've given a believable reason why she
didn't interfere with the wedding, but you haven't given any proof
that she wouldn't.  OOC.

Now, you criticized Bitter End in a post you made to RAAF a few months
back.  Among other things, you stated that it featured a friendship
between Ranma and Ukyou that wasn't present in the manga.  Well,
assuming, for the sake of an argument, that this is true, we still
have the fact that the situation between Ranma, Akane, and Ukyou had
changed to what it was in the manga, and changed in such a way to make
such a friendship more likely.  Clearly, then, it can be inferred from
this that you believe that characters are not allowed to change in
response to changing circumstances.

Now, in your fic, Soun learns to cook because Kasumi has left, and
Akane would otherwise be the one doing the cooking.  But, since he's
not allowed to change in response to this changing circumstance, he's
OOC.

Same with Shampoo.  The circumstances here are different from what
they were in Manga 38, but, since she isn't allowed to change with
them, she's OOC for not stopping the wedding.

Now, of course, I hope you realize that this is a little over the top.
However, all I'm doing is taking the characterization standards you
seem to have set for others, and applying them to your own works.  By
doing this, I hope it makes you realize that your ridiculously
stringent standards for characterization in other people's work are
not appropriate, and that perhaps an apology to Mr. Kyle and all the
others that you've given a hard time over this is in order.

-- -Sean Connor (sec@softhome.net) The day Microsoft produces something that doesn't suck is the day they start making vacuum cleaners.